F-Body Europe

Thanks Roy, you explain it better than I could.

I just try to explain that there is several dangers - maybe only 1 out of 100 times something bad happens. But if there is hundreds driving on nitrous every day, the risk for something bad to happen will be a hundred times higher than when it just get used on reasonable occasions (f.e. OSL races).
And the sad is, that mostly there is other people involved - and everybody has some responsibility towards environment and others.

Hope you're all having fun and I wish you good luck.

Where do you work Squirlly????

DRMO Kaiserslautern - Environmental Office

When me and the wife head out on the weekends to dive nobody is the least bit concerned that I have 2 tanks in the back that have no burst disks or blow down tubes and have twice the psi of a N2O tank.

As far as the heat making the the N and O2 seperate, your right (above 500deg ((reaching here, but the numbers run togethor))and i know its not a lower temp) there would be a chance of fueling the fire, but i would be more concerned with the 16 gallons of 93 sloshing around in the back if there were 'uber' sparks on the prowl when I drove around.

I have asked several cops to search they're manuals, and there is absolutely no reference to the carrying of N20 at all, atleast in Oklahoma. In some states your required to have stickers saying your so equiped, but a orange diamond its not.

Except for that Yo-Yo who left his bottle heater turned on with a "system" that was installed by Larry, Moe and himself and then tried to sue NX for his stupidity, I have never, ever heard of a N20 incident.

N20 got a bad rep from people putting a 300 shot on a car with #5 injectors and 50gph fuel pump blowing up they're engines........ooowwww Nitrous bad.
Now with the fast and furious crowd it is pure Satan in a bottle........RUN, its NAWWWWSSSSS!!!!

I hear ya Rob .

I just wonder how many people go to sleep while at the wheel of their or under the influence of NOS not because of faulty line connection but because of a faulty blowoff valve leaking or the guy that has his car baking in the hot Texas sun and the valve is doing what it is intended to . and that is vent excess psi . Same effect, person is under the influence of NOS.

Riddle me this, although in most states small cars and light trucks donot need safety placards . You take that same bottle and put in a OTR truck or on a plane and you get all kinds of inspectors on you.

Also lets say for giggles your in your Stang you got your 10lb bottle hooked up but the valve turned off and you just finished polishing up your new lightweight Magnesium wheels. Your wife wants you to stop by home depot to pick up some weed and feed with 16% urea and stop by the gas station and pick up a couple gls of gas for the mower.
Your on your way home and you stop at the light and you see a 35th SS lined up next to you . Your both throwing revs at each other, but you opt not to run because of the loose gas and fertilizer and because LS1's rule (had to put that in there). When all of sudden a Ford F250 runsin back of the stang. No body is hurt but you do smell gas comming from your trunk . You open the hatch and you see the gas can has ruptured and soaked the paper sack of fertilizer. As your walking away to figure this guys malfunction , the positeve spkr wire grounds on the Nos valve and creates a spark which ignites the gas fumes and the fertilizer. As this is burning the NOS tank psi is building up untill the relief valve releases and sends a shot of NOS directly in to the Fertilizer . This flares the fire which heats the bottle more until it ruptures. With the of the explosion going down and rupturing the gas tank . Now due to the way the blast was forced, one magnesium wheel catches fire and isburning like mad. Imagine being the fire dept coming up on this before all this started . Would you have been able to tell them what was in there .

Don't get me wrong NOS is good and if it is Properly regulated and NOS Systems Are inspected regulary then no problem.
But most people are uneducated about the dangers inherent with NOS or fail to properly mount it or check for in cabin leaks.

As for your Scuba Tanks Rob I do believe they have to go in for a , I believe what is called a Static test for compress gas cylinders every now and then.

Last year at Bitburg alone I seen two NOS systems in vettes that were just sitting in the passenger seat . And that was all that was holding it in there.

Peace all

Also lets say for giggles your in your Stang you got your 10lb bottle hooked up but the valve turned off and you just finished polishing up your new lightweight Magnesium wheels. Your wife wants you to stop by home depot to pick up some weed and feed with 16% urea and stop by the gas station and pick up a couple gls of gas for the mower.
Your on your way home and you stop at the light and you see a 35th SS lined up next to you . Your both throwing revs at each other, but you opt not to run because of the loose gas and fertilizer and because LS1's rule (had to put that in there). When all of sudden a Ford F250 runsin back of the stang. No body is hurt but you do smell gas comming from your trunk . You open the hatch and you see the gas can has ruptured and soaked the paper sack of fertilizer. As your walking away to figure this guys malfunction , the positeve spkr wire grounds on the Nos valve and creates a spark which ignites the gas fumes and the fertilizer. As this is burning the NOS tank psi is building up untill the relief valve releases and sends a shot of NOS directly in to the Fertilizer . This flares the fire which heats the bottle more until it ruptures. With the of the explosion going down and rupturing the gas tank . Now due to the way the blast was forced, one magnesium wheel catches fire and isburning like mad. Imagine being the fire dept coming up on this before all this started . Would you have been able to tell them what was in there .


That is big WTF. Nice story but you are reaching too far. Last I heard mixing gas and fretilizer creates and explosion when ignited (remember Oklahoma). I am not trying to knock you or make you look stupid but with all the safety devices they have for these systems you are sure to have a worry free ride. But human error is a mother. Running around with a 1/4 tank of gas is more hazardous since the vapors in the tank can be ignited with that peskie spark and explode the tank. Now you got me reaching. i don't think that there is anything wrong with having the systems hooked up or not hooked up with it bolted in place. Yes it did get a bad name early on, but that was in the early stages of production. Not trying to knock anyone, I just think that there are pros and cons out there. I'm sticking with the pros.

Hot rod
The systems arent the problem if done correctly . It is the cylinder it self when filled . Rob stated it takes about 500 degrees F to get NOS to Chemically break down. True

But did people also Know that NOS when it goes from liquid to vapor the cooling is I believe below -100F. Man thats instant freezing of skin.

Also did you (This was copied from a website)

Ignition of combustible materials will happen more readily in the presence of nitrous oxide. This is why the Department of Transportation (DOT) requires that cylinders containing nitrous oxide, meet the following requirement listed in the "Code of Federal Regulations" (CFR-49) section 173.304 "Charging of Cylinders with liquefied Compressed Gas" paragraph (a)(4)(ii);

Each cylinder must be cleaned in compliance with the requirements of Federal Specification RR-C-901c paragraph 3.7.2 and 3.8.2. Cleaning agents equivalent to those specified in RR-C-901c may be used; however, any cleaning agent must not be capable of reacting with oxygen. One cylinder selected at random from a group of 200 or less cleaned at the same time must be tested for oil contamination in accordance with Specification RR-C-901c paragraph 4.4.2.3 and meet the standard of cleanliness specified.


Cylinders manufactured by Catalina Cylinders for nitrous oxide service are cleaned and tested in accordance with RR-C-901-c at the time of manufacture. Cylinders that are manufactured for charges or fills other than oxygen and nitrous oxide have not been cleaned for oxygen or nitrous oxide service.

Conversion of cylinders not cleaned for oxygen or nitrous oxide service can be done but is not recommended by Catalina Cylinders. If such cylinders are to be converted to nitrous oxide service, the cylinders must be cleaned as if for oxygen service prior to filling with nitrous oxide.

Also, all cylinder accessories (i.e. valves, regulators, etc.) that will come into contact with the nitrous oxide charge must be compatible with oxygen and cleaned as if for oxygen service. The Compressed Gas Association (CGA) has two publications, pamphlet G-4.1 "Cleaning Equipment For Oxygen Service" and a directory "Directory of Cleaning Agents for Oxygen Service" that we recommend if such cleaning is to be done. Please note that after all cleaning operations it is recommended that the cylinder be dried completely to reduce the chance of corrosion from occurring.

So if Joe mechanic is installing your system and is using thread tape or pipe sealer that is not compatible with oxygen. Well I guess you get the biG Kaboom . Same thing with greasy hands.

There is federal and state regs out there . That doesn't mean every cop knows or can interpret . But they do a bang up job of interpreting speed tickets

Man that is alot of info. Are you trying to be a politician. I thought that we were discussing weather or not the cylinders filled with N2O were safe to be traveled in your car here in Germany. You have some very good infomation and it is good to know when you are converting from one to another. Give you a run down of my knowledge. I have been working on vehicles since I was 10 years old. Been doing it for the military for 13 years. I have been racing since I was 8 years old(dad started me in gocarts). I got into drag racing when I was 14 years old as a pit mechanic and some times a driver. I got to learn more than the average person on N2O. Also I have been doing metal working since I was 10 years old and that is the first thing that I was tought was that there is to be no oils or grease on the threads of the oxygen bottles. Simple, it will cause an explosion. So the info you just gave really didn't mean anything to the original point we were trying to get at, is N2O safe? and is it legal to have in Germany? If you tink the avreage person can't install the system take it to some one that can. I have installed a few system in friends car and to my knowledge they are still driving around safely.

Later dude

HEH, this is fun.

Your right Roy, the scuba tanks are hydro-static tested every 3 years, and visual inspected every year (rules is rules)

The biggest problem with Nitrous is the base kit is to cheap. A complete system is fairly expensive when you add all the "nice to haves" with them. Trust me on this as I have a NX, TNT and a NOS kit. (Dont ask ) You get your buddy that was standing next to a guy that knows a guy that saw a guy put in a kit and thinks he can do it too.

Dont know to much about 'okie' LS1's ruling anything? (just had to put that in ) hehe

Rob

just want to add that using N20 for anything other than drag racing would be stupid. You have less that 20 secs of gas in a 10lb bottle.

Hotrod you got a impressive background...

We answered the 'legal in Germany' question already with a 100% 'NO' for driving an active system on public roads.

Safe or not safe: It is environmentally regulated substance in compressed bottle - so there is always a risk - otherwise it would not need to be listed as such and have warning labels.

You're right, it always depends on the handling. If someone is in active dragracing and uses NOS I do believe he knows what he is doing. And that's ok for me.

What I don't like since Fast and Furious every wannabe in the neighborhood starts playing with Nitrous or other stuff without the knowledge ... and that is scary.
And they look at people like you and Hawk saying it is ok, it is safe, never heard of anything happened.

Again, it makes a big difference if there is 20 people with the knowledge using it,
or if there is 2000 people just want to illegal race on the autobahn experimenting with nitrous.

Of the number of people reading the posts to this thread there was only a few actually got into conversation and less which really knew the substance. Even I myself learned a lot in the past days because of studying information.

So I still say: Keep the bottle out the car if not needed, make sure the installation is correct done (by a professional) keep it manually disconnected when transporting on public roads and only activate the system when you are on the race track.

Thanks! I must have missed that post. You are right about keeping the N2O for the track. I was not trying to encourage others to go out and put a 150hp shot on their neon. I was trying to clear some smoke awy from the N2O is bad fire. Of all the years that I have been at the track I have never seen any N2O explosions that caused any deaths. I have seen N2O blow out of a promodifieds snorkel(trying to pump to much at one time). Didn't hurt the engine, just a really good show at dusk. You do have to watch what you are doing with it. To much will cause enginge failure. I respect the people that try to keep up or beat the best with all motor. Spraying is cheating in my book(on the streets). At the track is a different story, but for the average joe trying to spank some booty. You get my respect for whooping a$$ on a hooked up with mods. motor.

Later, Hot Rod

DRMO Kaiserslautern - Environmental Office [/quote]

Yes Knowledge is power. Ignorance is trouble. So if you plan to run NITROUS do yourself a favor and read up on it at least. I knew you were a tree hugger squirlly!!!

What's a tree hugger???

Don't try to hug them with my car...

That is what you are. Did ya know I tossed my cats in favor of LT headers I bet that is almost illegal?

You like to be the bad guy, don't ya.

Kinda ,sorta, maybe conflicting with you is fun. LOL

If you like conflicting with me...
wait 'til I finally get a car build up like I want.

Won't need NOS to kick your a** and eat ya' for snack!

(Pretty good smack talk for no real running car yet, ain't it?) LOL

Pretty good but I call BS time now on you. rule #1 you should always back up the smack you talk

If you would be just a little more patient than I am myself...running in circles already to get some done.
I'll back it up, hopefully this summer.

not without the giggle gas. I will smoke you is you are not packing a 500+hapee combination