F-Body Europe

Damn, you beat me to the posting.

YooHoo!!!!!
The fool knew how to start a war, but he had no clue on how to start peace!!!

WTF

I'll personally drive my copy of "Cobra II" down to your house for you to read and autograph.

He kept us employed!

Yes he did.

Yeah, and got a lot of your buddies killed.....
One day when you grow up you might see the big picture (which consists of more than somebody giving you three squares a day to satisfy your personal needs).

Yeah you are right also

I dont see this ending good

Can I resign too, since the democrats controll the senate and the house.

Too late Roy, you signed on the dotted line.
I'm not so taken with the Democrats myself, but something had to be done to bring the Republican government back to reality.
Anyway, I'll buy you a couple of beers and a burger to ease your pain.

mmmm....Peter's

I love how the "Non-American" knows more than me.

Several responses to your statement... you can choose one or more:

* Do you have to be American to know something? Is there something in the water that makes you smarter than everybody else?
* Maybe the non-American went to school and learned how to think.
* Maybe the non-American served in the Army, went to war in Angola, lost buddies, survived the mess and witnessed the futility of half-baked strategies.

If your first line of argument already defaults to a question of nationality, then I think that you answer your own statement.

I think he was just commenting on how most americans don't even know enough about what's going on to form any opinion on their own.

In that case I retract my mail

First, I don't think anyone from any country thinks that.
Second, I don't think you are the only person on this board who went to school and learned to think. In fact, I can almost assure you that there are at least some who are as educated as you and can think just as clearly. I'd be more than happy to compare the amount of time we have spent studying foreign policy, national security, other cultures, etc with you over any period of time whether it be the last week or the last 40 years, or any time period in between. You are definitely more knowledgeable than I am on engineering, but not on the subjects that this pertains to.
Third, you are definitely not the only one on this board who has served in the Army and lost friends. I personally spent over 30 years in the Air Force and have also lost several friends.

Sec Rumsfeld definitely made some mistakes, but at least he tried to do what is right. He was given the task of transforming out military and then had to fight a war at the same time. That is more than has been asked of any Secretary of Defense ever. History will show how well he did on both of those tasks, but I personally think he is the best SecDef we have had since I entered the military in 1968 so I think I have a little experience on which to base my opinion.

I fully support your right to your opinion, but I also think you should respect others opinions. The reality is that the Islamic fundamentalists want to restore the Mulim empire to what it was when it stretched from Spain to the Phillipines. This war started during the Carter administration when they overthrew the Shah of Iran and every President since then bears a share of the responsibility for allowing it to develop into the situation we have now. A absence of war is not necessarily the same as a long-lasting peace. Appesement doesn't work. It didn't work in the early 1900's, the late 1930's, or the 1950's and it won't work now. It only delays the inevitable and eventually causes even more people to die in a larger war. That is what history has shown and I can't see anything that has changed that reality. This war will last for many years, probably more than I will live, just because so many countries prefer appeasement. But the ultimate result will be the same. We will have to decide to either surrender or defeat them. You can't defeat fanatics, there are only two choices, kill them or surrender.

I personally am very fearful of the future for our Western civilization. I just wonder how long it will take for the average citizen to understand the problem and decide which way to go. Personally, I think we should kill them now and get it over with so we leave a better world for our children.

In closing, I'd like to paraphrase a quote I read some time ago. "All it takes for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing."

... which, I think, wasn't his own, but most likely a joint decision of a couple high-ranking military leaders, as well as several other political leaders of the US ... it's just as usual in politics: Somebody needs to take the blame for things not working out as intended (or hoped) ... question is just who is selected to be the pawn that is slaughtered ...

...but Islam is a religion of peace

All in the interpetation brother.

Jerry, I could not agree more.

No ONE person makes a decision in Washington. Hell, they have a cabinet postition just for what to eat for lunch. Rumsfled was the man! I'd rather have a guy with some balls than one with brains. He has advisors to handle the thinkng part.

We are in Iraq finishing what the Clinton administration should have done. If you knock a country down, its a good practice to help them instead of letting them go and letting just anyone come in and start something worse. (WW1)

Everyone always gives the current administration grief. History will make that determination. Either history, or Sean Penn and the Dixie Chicks.